|
|
| (23 intermediate revisions by 6 users not shown) |
| Line 2: |
Line 2: |
| | | | |
| | I'm sure that some must do sometimes but I have no knowledge of it. Commercial male strippers, for example, don't exactly 'dance' do they? (Genuine question - I've never been to a male strip show!) If you can add content, please feel free to do so. --[[User:Interesdom|Interesdom]] 06:32, 6 September 2007 (BST) | | I'm sure that some must do sometimes but I have no knowledge of it. Commercial male strippers, for example, don't exactly 'dance' do they? (Genuine question - I've never been to a male strip show!) If you can add content, please feel free to do so. --[[User:Interesdom|Interesdom]] 06:32, 6 September 2007 (BST) |
| − |
| |
| − | == Salome ==
| |
| − | Salome's alleged "Seven Veils" are not mentioned in the Bible at all. Is part of the Salome section copied from somewhere?
| |
| − |
| |
| − | Also, Dance plays a large role in the Gor novels... [[User:AnonMoos|AnonMoos]] 19:45, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
| |
| − |
| |
| − | :Yeah, well, the character of Salome certainly originates with the Gospels. The kinky details that her story has later acquired -- the "Seven Veils" striptease, suggestions of incest and modern BDSM play, "Back! Daughter of Babylon!" et cetera -- seem to have been embellished by later artists and writers like Oscar Wilde and Liliana Cavani.
| |
| − | :No, this section of the article was not copied from elsewhere. I revised the content a bit over the weekend to try to keep it more focused and relevant to the theme of this website. --[[User:Languishing in Despondency|Lycraman]] 20:22, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
| |
| − |
| |
| − | ::Well, the seven veils and the name "Salome" itself do '''NOT''' occur in the actual text of the Bible (the only occurrence of the word "Salome" in the New Testament is near the end of the Gospel of Mark, where it obviously refers to a completely different woman). In the text of the New Testament, she's referred to only as the "daughter of Herodias", or "the girl", and there's no indication that her dance is a particularly erotic one (and in fact, as a member of the local princely ruling family, not a lower-class or slave entertainer, it would have been highly unusual for her to dance in an explicitly erotic fashion). It's unfortunate that this article fails to distinguish between the Bible and later folklore... [[User:AnonMoos|AnonMoos]] 12:56, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
| |
| − |
| |
| − | ::::Why don't you amend that section of the article, then, and clarify the distinction between what is actually mentioned in the Gospels and what is apparently the product of later folklore. Also, bear in mind that the books of the bible have had many redactors over the past 2000 years. Could it be said that the popular story of Salome is "biblical folklore", since it does refer to a major biblical character like John the Baptist? This site isn't about biblical scholarship and archaeology anyway. I just added the bit about Salome and the Dance of the Seven Veils insofar as it ''is'' folklore -- with tenuous origins in the Gospels -- which has since been used as a kind of metaphor for modern notions of striptease and BDSM play. --[[User:Languishing in Despondency|Lycraman]] 21:28, 17 December 2007 (UTC)
| |
| − |
| |
| − | Come off it. Salome was a real person, the daughter of Herod and thus the granddaughter of Herod the great. While for some reason Matthew fails to mention her name, it is recorded by Josephus.--[[User:Taxwoman|Taxwoman]] 20:11, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
| |
| − |
| |
| − | ::For all we know the actual name, Salome, may have once been present in an early version of the Gospel of Matthew. By the time that the King James Bible was written in the early seventeenth century, the name may have long since been redacted from the text for whatever reason (the Athanasian creed, et cetera). But this is all pure speculation on my part, of course. Salome and the Dance of the Seven Veils occurs in Pasolini's Gramscian-Marxist film interpretation of the Gospel of Matthew as a metaphor for Fascist/capitalist coercion/exploitation.--[[User:Languishing in Despondency|Lycraman]] 00:55, 20 December 2007 (UTC)
| |
| − | :::What has [http://anglicansonline.org/basics/athanasian.html the Athanasian Creed] got to do with anything? And the text of the Gospels is witnessed by documents dating back to the time of Athanasius or earlier. Sorry, I know this is screamingly off topic.--[[User:Speedoslover|Speedoslover]] 22:54, 21 December 2007 (UTC)
| |
| − |
| |
| − | ::::Athanasius had his own agenda, so who knows? Are you a biblical scholar? The Gospels were written down about 100 years after the events described allegedly took place. Is "screamingly" a proper adverb? --[[User:Languishing in Despondency|Lycraman]] 17:25, 23 December 2007 (UTC)
| |
I'm sure that some must do sometimes but I have no knowledge of it. Commercial male strippers, for example, don't exactly 'dance' do they? (Genuine question - I've never been to a male strip show!) If you can add content, please feel free to do so. --Interesdom 06:32, 6 September 2007 (BST)
